What's a Christian to Do with the Enneagram?

Dive into the intersection of faith and personality as the Parenting to Impress Podcast duo discusses the spiritual implications and use of the Enneagram. Addressing concerns about its possible evil origins, we explore how Christians can thoughtfully approach and utilize this tool used to understand the nine personality types. Join us as we explore what a Christian is to do with the Enneagram and its potential for spiritual growth, parenting, and healthy relationships.

Helpful Links from this Episode:  Some linked items are affiliate links. This means that we receive an itty-bitty commission if you choose to purchase through these links.  

• Free Enneagram Cheat Sheet
• Road Back to You by Ian Morgan Cron
• The Enneagram for Teens by Ainsley Britain
• Should Self-Help Books be Used in Your Quiet Time podcast episode and blog post

Episode Sponsor:  ABCJesusLovesMe.com, an educational ministry that equips adults with the materials needed to be intentional in educating children.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Exploring the Enneagram
• 10:06 Understanding the Impact of Enneagram
• 24:16 Exploring Enneagram Resources for Teens

Transcript

This transcript has been edited for clarity.  Some linked items are affiliate links. This means that we receive an itty-bitty commission if you choose to purchase through these links. 

Heidi Franz Host 00:00

I find the brain absolutely fascinating. How God created each person beautifully unique, yet with similar traits, is humbling and amazing. That's probably why I have enjoyed learning about personalities. It has helped me understand myself, work with others and better parent my kids. Today we're going to dive into the Enneagram. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 00:23

There are a lot of opinions about the Enneagram. We're going to talk about what it is - the good, bad, the ugly. What do we do with the Enneagram? 

Heidi Franz Host 00:30

Welcome back to Parenting to Impress, your go-to podcast, to learn practical ways to love God and love others and impress this on the hearts of your children. I am your host, Heidi Franz, and I am joined by my dear friend, Melanie Simpson.  Two moms who have made a lot of mistakes but have found grace and truth along the way. 

So, Melanie, there are some people listening who are very familiar with the Enneagram. They know what number they are. They know what number their spouse is, their kids are. They love the Enneagram. 

There are those who are listening who do not like the Enneagram, which we'll talk about in a few minutes.  Then there's other people who don't know what the Enneagram is.  So let's start with that first. Melanie, how would you describe the Enneagram to somebody who has never heard of it? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 01:21

My take is it is a personality tool, another tool in our toolbox to help us learn more about ourselves. But, like all worldly tools… some that say the Enneagram came from some more darker, negative origins. We have to be wise consumers of anything, and Enneagram is just another one of those. 

Heidi Franz Host 01:44

So when I think of the Enneagram, I immediately think of the nine categories that people are put into. Each type or #1 through #9 represents a different way of thinking and feeling and behaving. This framework provides an awareness and area for personal growth. When you start thinking about how people are motivated, what their fears are and what their desires are.  Do you feel like the Enneagram has been helpful to you? Hurtful? What are your thoughts about it on a personal level? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 02:23

That's a great question because initially I caught the excitement and did some reading.  My sister and I did the test together.  It's fun, right, to see how people in your life answer the same questions that you answer so differently.  It's really interesting. It can be very eye-opening.  

But I will tell you that as I learned more about it, I became a little hesitant, because the origins of the Enneagram are kind of unclear and there are some parts of its history that are, I would say, contrary to what Bible-believing Christians are told to engage with. I was kind of conflicted, in all honesty, and so I pushed pause and I just prayed about it.  I asked for the Lord to help me have some clear thinking about it, and ultimately, what I walked away with is the Enneagram for me and our family is another tool that is helpful to learn more about the people in my family, myself in particular.  But it still has to be in submission to the Lord and we have to be really mindful that the Enneagram is not our gospel. 

Heidi, how did you come to hear about it? What's your take? 

Heidi Franz Host 03:34

I first heard about the Enneagram about seven or eight years ago, sitting around the table after church one day with a bunch of our community group, and they were talking about this word Enneagram. I didn't know what they were talking about, and somebody let me borrow one of their books. It was actually the Road Back to You, which is a very popular book on the Enneagram that focuses on the Christian side as well.  So I started reading it and I was like, “Oh, this is cool, I love this.” 

Now some of that says what Enneagram number I am, the fact that I loved it so much.  I found it so eye-opening and it has been very impactful for me spiritually to be able to sit down and ask myself, “In what ways am I healthy with the personality God has given me and in what ways am I unhealthy?”

 Even today, Melanie.  This hasn't been the best week for me, I'll be honest. I was driving after picking up one of my kiddos from an activity that they had and I got a text from a friend.  I wanted to ignore the text and I immediately realized “Oh, when I am in an unhealthy place in my life, my tendency is to draw back from those who are loving on me.” So, it was a clue for me. Whoa Heidi, you need to figure out some things. You're moving toward some unhealthy tendencies. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 05:21

Yeah, knowing you as I do, what I hear you saying is under the umbrella of spiritual conviction you realized an area of need in your life. 

I think this is probably what I like about the Enneagram is that it gives us language to talk about our personalities, our family's personalities, and relationships in a more specific way, because I think most of us don't know how to. 

We have these feelings or emotions.  We know something's not right or maybe something is good, but we don't have the verbs or the language to talk about it. The Enneagram helps us be able to have conversations not just with others, but with the Lord.

I can go to the Lord and say I am so clearly a peacemaker and that so easily slides into people-pleasing. And, Lord, your word tells me very clearly that I am to seek pleasing you above man. So help me to know, when I am falling down that rabbit hole of seeking to please people instead of You.  

That's what I hear you saying that it just gives you another indicator. It's like the dashboard on your car when something lights up. We could ignore it, and lots of people do, but it can lead to some more serious issues. 

So how do you, Heidi, use this as a tool in submission to scripture, to your prayer life? What does that look like practically? 

Heidi Franz Host 06:49

Just laying it out there I'm a #1 on the Enneagram scale. I am a perfectionist.  My core desire is to be a good person. I fear being wrong, and it's not a case of I just don't want to be wrong. No, it's a case that I would let somebody down because I was incorrect. My message is it's not okay to make mistakes.

Now in my spiritual life that creates a legalistic approach to Christianity. That also leads me for fear that I am not living up to what God has asked me to do, or fear that I will let God down. I have had to learn that God's love for me does not wax and wane depending upon what I have done…my performance. That's why the Enneagram has been so helpful to me as a guage. Why did I always have this fear as a child, as a teen, as a young adult of God coming and squashing me? Well, that's because I feared that I wasn't good enough. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 08:17

So interesting. 

I think you would acknowledge too that you could have learned this from another book, another tool. It's just that Enneagram was the tool God used to speak to you. The language it used was the most clearly communicated. 

I think that's kind of an important takeaway for our listeners is that we're not saying that you have to use the Enneagram. Absolutely not. We have found it helpful and useful. 

But what I love that you touched on is that you knew the character of God because of your time spent in studying God's word. You and I would both say, if you have not and are not spending time in scripture, please don't pick up the Enneagram. People pick it up expecting it to be the answer to your problems, the cure-all, and you and I would both say no, there is no substitute for knowing God and His Word. 

Heidi Franz Host 09:16

Christ is the only solution to that problem.   I also think that the Enneagram can be used as an excuse. It also can be used as kind of a weapon saying, “You do this because you are an Enneagram #3 or an Enneagram #4.”  Instead it has allowed me to be able to see why other people do what they do, to have a better understanding and to look at the body of Christ as a body where every single person, every single personality, has a purpose in God's Kingdom and furthering that Kingdom. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 10:06

Right.  I think for the folks who would say it's dark and has more evil origins…I agree that is valid.  But I would say any writing, anything that comes from the world, is tinged with sin. Short of scripture, there is nothing that we read, even scientific study… There's nothing that is untainted by sin. Proverbs 3 is clear. We have to be always aware that we trust the Lord, we trust his word, and that is how we filter everything else out. 

Heidi Franz Host 10:40

And I would say, Mel, that applies to all self-help books. We did a podcast and I will put that in the show notes about using self-help books for your quiet time. What we are talking about right now is not scripture, is not a quiet time. It is a tool, and any tool can be used well or it can be used for evil, right? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 11:10

Right. 

Heidi Franz Host 11:10

So tell me, how has the Enneagram affected you personally? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 11:15

I think that it has, like you, given me kind of a fresh vocabulary to talk about how God hardwired me. But, to your point, it has also been helpful in reminding me and leaning into the Holy Spirit to remind me that with Christ in me I am changeable.  God has given me the capacity to not just be a peacemaker. I also have the capacity to be a perfectionist or a dreamer or an adventurer. The fun part is then when I think about the nine personalities on the Enneagram, I see all of the opportunities that God has provided for me to grow and challenge me.  Then to be really mindful about submitting my strengths to the Lord, because it's not for my glory, it's for His glory. 

Heidi Franz Host 12:15

Yes, yes, and that is an example of the healthy versus unhealthy side of each Enneagram number. The healthy side is when a creative person (#4 on the Enneagram) is using their creativity that God gave them for His glory. The unhealthy is when that creativity is pulling them away from other people to isolate or feel shameful. That is not what God created them to be. 

One of the things that the Enneagram gets a bad name about is that it puts people into boxes.  What you are saying is, no, it is opened your box. Would you agree with that? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 13:03

Yeah.  In my flesh I can just say, “Oh, I'm a #2, I don't do that, or I can't do that. That's not my strength.” 

You opened this podcast talking about how fascinated you are with the brain.  I think about so many things that I've read, nonfiction works, that talk about brains and neurology and neural pathways and neuroplasticity and all this kind of stuff.  How much of it affirms what the Lord has already told us in scripture. It's just not in scientific language or it's just not in Enneagram language or whatever.  What’s fun is to see how the “world” continues to tell us things that God already told us. 

Heidi Franz Host 13:46

So let's dive into two other areas. First, how has the Enneagram affected your friendship? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 13:53

It gives me another tool in my toolbox for relating to other people. When you learn something about a friend, especially when you are both believing Christians, it presents another opportunity to encourage one another and to speak life into one another. 

But the other side is, with friends and people that I meet who are not believers, the Enneagram can be a really neat entree into conversation. A lot of people are familiar with the Enneagram and are interested by it.  It can be an opportunity to have conversations. 

Heidi Franz Host 14:34

Ainsley Britton just wrote a brand new book called The Enneagram for Teens, and I had the opportunity to review this book.  In it she talks about ways to handle conflict with teens based upon their Enneagram number. I would say this applies to adults as well. 

So, thinking about you being a #2 on the Enneagram and me being a #1 on the Enneagram, let's say we had a conflict.  You coming to me, the best way to handle conflict is for you to be honest, direct and be very clear with what you're thinking. That is going to help us deal with the conflict the best possible way. But yet, if I would come to you in that way, Melanie, how would that feel? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 15:42

You coming at me direct like that, I would be like, “Whoa, she's mad at me. What did I do wrong? How do I hurry up and fix this and make things?”

Heidi Franz Host 15:54

So the book actually says one of the best ways to handle conflict with a #2 is with compliment sandwiches. A positive, and then whatever the issue is, and following it up by another positive. Do you agree with that? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 16:12

One hundred percent. It is so affirming.

But because I know you and your heart, I know Heidi wants to fix this. My way of loving you well is to cut to the chase. That's the beautiful part when somebody loves you so much that they care about how they approach you, you're think, “Of course I'm gonna do whatever it takes.” 

Heidi Franz Host 16:35

Maybe this is the #1 thing, but I kind of felt like everybody was like me until I realized there are a lot of layers to our personalities. So in friendships it has allowed me, hopefully, to be a little softer and understand that not everybody is going to approach things the way I do. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 17:03

Yeah, how many times in your life are you, stopped in your tracks, especially in marriage.  You're thinking, “This man does not understand what I'm saying. He clearly is not thinking about this the same way I am.”  More often than not, what happens is that becomes another source of conflict and tension, because you're thinking, “I don't know how else to say this to you, ‘Guy is blue, the sky is blue. The sky is blue.’”   Your husband is thinking, “But they're also clouds, and sometimes it's gray.”

I think that's one of the things that the Enneagram can be helpful for is giving us pause and remember that his brain works differently than mine. What a gift that we're not all the same. That would be a boring world. 

Heidi Franz Host 17:45

Absolutely so. Here's another example.  My husband is a #9 on the Enneagram. You know how I stated that I want honesty and clarity in a confrontation? My husband wants me to patiently listen to him. I mean, Mel, that is excruciating for me.  But when I realized it, then I was able to step back. One thing that I can do to love him well is to repeat what I think he said. That helps him feel heard. For me, that's a huge waste of time because it's been said. It has helped me be able to better understand my husband and not question why is he doing this. God created him this way to help us be stronger, and I can love him well by slowing down. 

Tell me, how has the Enneagram affected your parenting? 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 19:01

I only know two, maybe three, but not my youngest Enneagram numbers. What's interesting is when you do the Enneagram questions and you hear them answering the questions…We didn't say this before, but there's a whole series of questions that you go through to narrow down your Enneagram number.  That's the part that has been so interesting to me. When you think about your family, it’s amazing how my kids come from the same two people and yet are so different and yet are so alike. 

How about you? 

Heidi Franz Host 19:36

It was interesting in this book The Enneagram for Teens, it is into the late teens, early 20s, before you can really start to see what a person's Enneagram number is. And it's interesting that you said you know your oldest two or three, but you're not sure about number four. And I would say the exact same thing.  I know my oldest two. I just discovered my third child's and I'm not really sure about my youngest. 

Knowing their numbers has shown me how I can love my kids better. Interestingly, my daughter is a #2, the same as you, Mel.  I gave her the page that says, “You might be a #1 if…”.  There were 10 different ideas to read through.  She said, “Mom, nine out of the 10 of those are spot on. There's one here that is not me.” She is not offended by criticism, which I thought was interesting. I think she's probably a two with a #1 wing.   

This was confirming to me that I can go and talk to her about things. But yet it was also remindful that I need to be careful that I am encouraging her, that I'm not taking her help for granted. 

Little Man is a #8 with a 7 wing.  He is starting to making sense to me, because he is not trusting. And because he is not trusting, he is always fearful that somebody is going to take advantage of him or what he shares. It's made me be careful about the words that I say to him. 

Melanie Simpson CoHost 21:38

One of the things that I like about Enneagram in particular is how it addresses core fears for you.  I have found them to be pretty spot on. I have thought about that often with my older two in relation to how I parent them and it's a good reminder for when I see them kind of sinking into unhealth - to speak against that core fear.  I can use my words to encourage and speak scripture, just remind them who they are in the Lord. All of these things are tools that help us connect with the people we love, address unhealth, as you say.  

Heidi Franz Host 22:23

And, I would say also pray for those people. 

It helps me understand what is going on in their heads.  The why behind what they're doing.

One of my prayers for Little Man right now is that he would trust me and that the enemy would not have a stronghold on these fears. That God's word and the truth from God's word would be loud and clear and that people would be coming around him to speak this truth against this mistrust. 

In reviewing The Enneagram for Teens, and then thinking about the Road Back to You, I created a cheat sheet that looks at each one of the Enneagram for desire, core fear, message received, deadly sin, healthy or growing, unhealthy or stressed, and conflict resolution. And I've created this for you to use in the ways that we have talked about, whether that is in knowing how to love someone better, in checking on your own health or spiritual disconnect, in thinking through how can you best talk to somebody, in thinking through how to pray for other people and love them. 

Well, this Enneagram Cheat Sheet is not standalone. If you're going to just look at this and not read about it, I think it may very much confuse you.  So I encourage you to use it alongside a Christian-based Enneagram book. I suggest the Road Back to You or The Enneagram for Teens. I will include links in the show notes that I think will be helpful. 

Again, we're not saying this is the end all, but we are saying that the Enneagram can be a tool.  And if it can be helpful to you, I encourage you to check it out. 

Announcer 24:38

We want to thank you for listening to the Parenting to Impress podcast. Be sure to visit ABCJesusLovesMe.com and check out the show notes for more information on topics shared in this episode. Please subscribe and share with your friends.